Advice needed on poecilotheria metalica

[Gordon]

I can understand your concerns and tbh I was as well that's why I was asking advice from people who had them in case it was stupid and dangerous, personally I have always been a believer in keep what you want to keep as long as you know what your getting into as chances are you will care for an animal you want rather than something you have to settle for, for instance my first snake was a red tailed boa something that most snake owners say is too much of a snake for an inexperienced owner, in my experience she has been more friendly and much more entertaining to own than a corn snake or other begginer species, I think the P.Metallica is a beutifull species and if I can only have 2 display vivs in my living room I know that's the one I want to look at, so far I haven't had any issues with it , I did have a little bit if bother when my landlord seen them and initially told me I had to get rid of them but he has realised that they are really no harm to the property and now both my B.smithI and P.metalica are happily living in a custom display viv, the fact that i understand the seriousness of the venom in this species i know to have plenty precations in place when it comes to maintenance, for instance the water dish that I know needs cleaned and filled is right beside the door to minimise how much I need to open it, and having the boa I have plenty of long 2ft plus tongs for removing anything that needs to be removed without the need to open the viv more than a quarter and I do this when I can see him resting comfortably at the opposite side and have 2 catch cups just in case

 

[Gordon]

The set up is actually a 2.5x1x1 vivarium that I divided with a sheet of moisture resistant mdf, I then used a piece of cork bark to build a wall and create a deep substrate with spiderlife and sphagnum moss to maintain a high humidity in the enclosure and attached a heat mat to the left side wall , I have the heat mat on the divider wall inside the b.smithi side so that also keeps the pokies side a little warmer which they prefer and installed a colour changing led which is usually off or occasionally on red setting as that won't disturb him as much but I also have the option of changing the colour with a remote to see his true colours

 

[Venom2090]

I thought smithi was a Poecilotheria not another genus. Might be wrong.

Brachypelma smithi. Now harmorri. Not P smithi.


This is exactly what I meant about learning basic husbandry before acquiring potent species. Heat mats can cause burns, dehydration, etc. They are not very suitable for inverts unless properly stated.

Room temperature is fine for both species. (70)


Sorry, divider!? You mean you tried to split the cage in half? That is a very poor decision. I've personally seen cases where beginners ignored advice and did this, and lost a spider within days. If you do not have proper cages for your animals, you should not own them.


Whats the ventilation like in there?

Lights don't belong in or on tarantula cages. They don't like it. Best remove it or keep it off and only on for a few minutes at a time for viewing.

Thise sliding lids are bad choices. Spiders can slip through very tight spaces.

 

[Enn49]

I thought smithi was a Poecilotheria not another genus. Might be wrong.

There is a Poecilotheria smithi as well

 

[Metalman2004]

Brachypelma smithi. Now harmorri. Not P smithi.


This is exactly what I meant about learning basic husbandry before acquiring potent species. Heat mats can cause burns, dehydration, etc. They are not very suitable for inverts unless properly stated.

Room temperature is fine for both species. (70)


Sorry, divider!? You mean you tried to split the cage in half? That is a very poor decision. I've personally seen cases where beginners ignored advice and did this, and lost a spider within days. If you do not have proper cages for your animals, you should not own them.


Whats the ventilation like in there?

Lights don't belong in or on tarantula cages. They don't like it. Best remove it or keep it off and only on for a few minutes at a time for viewing.

Thise sliding lids are bad choices. Spiders can slip through very tight spaces.

I usually stay out of the husbandry debates (there seem to have been a lot of heated ones lately) but I’ll chime in to agree on this one as well.

Let me be clear though, I wouldn’t have said don’t get a P metallica because you aren’t ready. I would have said do more homework...

These are my thoughts and suggestions:

Pokies need ventilation and I don’t see any in the enclosure.

Tarantulas are not fans of light. I’d keep that bulb off. Also, LED bulbs get REALLY hot. If you look at the bulb you’ll see a bunch of metal fins in the back. That is to dissipate the large amounts of heat they put off. Be very careful with that around the spiders.

On “the other forum” there is a thread about a guy wanting to do a divided enclosure (similar to the method you used if I am understanding you right). Everyone told him not to do it but he did anyways and his two Ts became one. I suggest you read that and then think about using two seperate enclosures instead.

Furthermore, that mdf board you have in there has super high levels of formaldohyde in it. Indoubt it is very good for your spiders.

Hear mats are considered a no no as well because it can dry the air out and it could burn the tarantula and mess with its behavior based on placement. As @Venom2090 said, if your apartment is 70 degrees or higher you don’t need it anyways.

If I were you I’d seriously consider changing some stuff. Good luck!

 

[Whitelightning777]

There is a Poecilotheria smithi as well

I think that avicularia smithi used to be named. Some sources say it was changed to B. Smithi, but that makes no sense because the Mexican red knee is a terrestrial!!

?????? I'm stumped

 

[Checkmate]

I think that avicularia smithi used to be named. Some sources say it was changed to B. Smithi, but that makes no sense because the Mexican red knee is a terrestrial!!

?????? I'm stumped

IIRC, hobby Brachypelma smithi was actually Brachypelma hamorii the whole time and is now correctly identified.

 

[Gordon]

Ok so if I lose the heat mat the temps will be at 19°c is that ok for temperature? From everywhere I've read room temp is ok as long as it is around 22°Cto25°C I've noticed that he accepts food more willingly with it on than he does when I ran it off to test this out, it sits at 22°c with it on and is only a 7w mat so it's not going to overheat or cook him , tarantulas are cold blooded so must therefore be capable of thermoregulating themselves, yes I split a viv in half not because I don't have sufficient vivs, I have plenty spare vivs lying around but I wanted a cool project and I think it turned out great, as for ventilation it is hard to see but the original vents are still in either side, the divider sits In the middle of one as well, regards to lighting I did say that they are usually off vecause i know they dont like light but I do like the option of being able to see him every now and then so the led remote setup works perfect for this and led is not hot lol it's actually the coldest style of lighting you can use, literally every other type of lighting is hotter than led that's the main reason they are such an efficient bulb aswell and this one is 3watts which is why I picked it because it won't and doesn't affect temps in the enclosure,

 

[Enn49]

Ok so if I lose the heat mat the temps will be at 19°c is that ok for temperature? From everywhere I've read room temp is ok as long as it is around 22°Cto25°C I've noticed that he accepts food more willingly with it on than he does when I ran it off to test this out, it sits at 22°c with it on and is only a 7w mat so it's not going to overheat or cook him , tarantulas are cold blooded so must therefore be capable of thermoregulating themselves, yes I split a viv in half not because I don't have sufficient vivs, I have plenty spare vivs lying around but I wanted a cool project and I think it turned out great, as for ventilation it is hard to see but the original vents are still in either side, the divider sits In the middle of one as well, regards to lighting I did say that they are usually off vecause i know they dont like light but I do like the option of being able to see him every now and then so the led remote setup works perfect for this and led is not hot lol it's actually the coldest style of lighting you can use, literally every other type of lighting is hotter than led that's the main reason they are such an efficient bulb aswell and this one is 3watts which is why I picked it because it won't and doesn't affect temps in the enclosure,

You think a heat mat can't over heat - take a look at this (one of those 6"x4"). We were lucky it didn't set fire to the house.

 

[Gordon]

That's scary looking it is lucky it didn't cause a fire, i was meaning overheat as in the t won't be too warm as opposed to the actual mat overheating I keep my heat mats on a timer, 20mins on and 20off just because I don't like the idea of them running for days at a time , tbh I'm not a fan of heat mats but I need to do something to raise the temps from 19°C and a ceramic would be too much, was that mat covered? I know they can do that if they are under wooden vivs or covered so that the heat gets trapped and builds up

 

[Enn49]

That's scary looking it is lucky it didn't cause a fire, i was meaning overheat as in the t won't be too warm as opposed to the actual mat overheating I keep my heat mats on a timer, 20mins on and 20off just because I don't like the idea of them running for days at a time , tbh I'm not a fan of heat mats but I need to do something to raise the temps from 19°C and a ceramic would be too much, was that mat covered? I know they can do that if they are under wooden vivs or covered so that the heat gets trapped and builds up

It was inside a wooden vivarium with just beech chip substrate on top. Sadly it didn't have a thermostat on it which would have prevented it over heating and 2 Green Anoles died. This is why I am so strict now about using thermostats with all heat sources.

 

[Gordon]

That's crazy, definitely a picture a lot of people should get to see just to highlight the dangers, some of the manufacturers say they can't have more than 1cm of substrate or it can block them and overheat but you wouldn't think a small layer of beech chips would cause that

 

[Enn49]

That's crazy, definitely a picture a lot of people should get to see just to highlight the dangers, some of the manufacturers say they can't have more than 1cm of substrate or it can block them and overheat but you wouldn't think a small layer of beech chips would cause that

I never bought that make again, I stick with the solid black ones.

 

[Metalman2004]

led is not hot lol it's actually the coldest style of lighting you can use, literally every other type of lighting is hotter than led that's the main reason they are such an efficient bulb aswell and this one is 3watts which is why I picked it because it won't and doesn't affect temps in the enclosure,

http://www.ledsmagazine.com/articles/2005/05/fact-or-fiction-leds-don-t-produce-heat.html

LEDs Magazine and many others disagree with your statement. Here is a quote from the article above:

“The energy consumed by a 100-watt GLS incandescent bulb produces around 12% heat, 83% IR and only 5% visible light. In contrast, a typical LED might produce15% visible light and 85% heat.”

Cheap LED bulbs are extra prone to heat and have started fires similar to the heat mat situation. All I’m saying is you should check it after its been on for a while. If you’ve already checked it then no worries.

The biggest thing I’d be worried about isnthat piece of chemical-soaked MDF in the enclosure...

 

[Gordon]

What what led mag reads that applies only to infra red led and high output units not a 3w bulb, I know there are the types that put out heat such as the ones that grow tomatoes about 100w and above and have fans built into them to remove the heat, the one I have I could have running for days and be able to hold it but even so it is only switched on when I want to have a look at them, I appreciate the mdf may not be the best to use and had I known that prior to the build id have used a different material

 

[Miss Moxie]

I can pull up a ton of examples where a split vivarium has resulted in the death of one or both of the tarantulas involved. When you purchase a living creature you are directly assuming responsibility for this living thing's life. That means putting your own wants after what is best for them.

If you have the space and the means then there is no reason to use a split enclosure, save for your aesthetic pleasure. In fact, you even admitted it yourself that you wanted something 'cool.'

Maybe you're thinking 'yeah but if I do it correctly the risk is practically nominal' and again, I respond with you're forcing a living creature into something less than ideal and putting them at risk no matter how nominal because it is what you want, not what is best.

 

[Venom2090]

If you can not provide for the animals properly. You shouldn't own them. This is a simple, logical concept.

 

[Gordon]

Ok as far as I thought I was providing them with an adequately sized enclosure, much larger than the recommended size for an adult t of both species, the enclosure I have sits well within temp range of both species and humidity levels are perfect for both species, if extra ventilation is the only issue i can easily drill some holes in it allthough the original vents are not blocked in any way, yes I do want a display viv that looks cool who doesn't want that but obviously not to the detriment of any animal, both ts to me seem perfectly happy and eating and my b.smithi molted last week, as with any new hobby there is always lots to learn and a lifetime of information to take in, I asked this advice well in advance of purchasing the t and from the information I received I got one, now a month after owning him the thread has boomed into life again to tell me that it's not a good idea, I'm sorry but it's a bit late for that now but thankfully he is settled in, webbing up and eating well , why is splitting a viv such a dangerous thing to do?

 

[Gordon]

@Venom2090 that last post mate seriously? I think thats a bit common sense and obviously i agree with you on that, it's not like I'm trying to keep it in a shoebox or something, as far as I was aware my setup ticks all the boxes on a poecilotheria care sheet so I thought I was doing good and from any pics I posted up until now it's only been compliments so excuse me for being a little defensive when all of a sudden it's not ok , I am new to the hobby and I'm willing and wanting to learn but there is a way of educating someone

 

[Enn49]

@Gordon I've just checked through this thread and although you asked advice about getting a P.met nowhere did you ask advice about the container until after you'd got the T and even then you made sure the pictures didn't show that it was a divided vivarium. People have tried to explain why your set up is wrong but you have argued every point so my question is do you really want advice from those more experienced than you or do you just want to cause arguments? We are all here to help each other but if you won't listen people will soon get sick of trying to help you.