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Wild Collectors

Discussion in 'Invertebrate Pet Talk' started by Lioth, Feb 6, 2013.

  1. Lioth

    Lioth New Member

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    Do any of you breed wild scorpions, tarantulas, true spiders, and other inverts for pet trade? The idea I have is that I am trying to breed a certain scorp specie by getting a wild male and female. By the time they reproduce, perhaps some babies might get eaten. I shall free a few scorplings, and then keep some of them as pets and probably sell them too. I think that this way, their population should not be a problem.
  2. Scoolman

    Scoolman Well-Known Member 3 Year Member 1,000+ Post Club

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    Strict wild collecting is not good. The goal is to produce captive bred specimen for collection, thus releaving pressure on wild populations.
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  3. Nada

    Nada Moderator 1,000+ Post Club

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    I agree completely. I do my best to avoid any and all wc animals.
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  4. AngelOtter

    AngelOtter Member

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    I don't buy anything wild-caught, as a biologist I know what that does to wild populations, and it's not good. Wild populations of Ts, lizards, snakes, scorpions etc have been decimated by collection for the pet trade. Captive bred is the best option if you care about keeping the wild population safe.
    Not trying to attack you or anything, it's just one of my pet peeves. Wild animals are great to look at or study, but they are wild, and should stay that way.
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  5. Lioth

    Lioth New Member

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    @AngelOtter I thought of that too dude. The thing is that Emperor Scorpions are the only guys I have in my home and they're pretty popular in pet trade. The people here are not aware that their venom's not dangerous, and because some of them have heard stories and read books saying that scorpions are dangerous like all of them are capable of killing human beings even though majority of them are not dangerous. So I just basically thought it would be great to keep these scorpions at home since most of them are being killed here, I'm serious, they're being killed and I've seen that lots of times before. I've also heard that they're one of the biggest scorpions in the world. Wow, how cool is that? They're the biggest ones I've ever seen. That's most likely it, and I'm truly aware that wild animals are a no-no because of the decimation of their population for pet trade.
  6. AngelOtter

    AngelOtter Member

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    You stated "scorpions, tarantulas, true spiders, and other inverts only in the wild", not just emperors. And yes, emperors are popular in the pet trade, so why would you take a wild one? Taking it out of the wild is the same as someone killing it, there is one less scorpion in the wild, eating insects and affecting it's environment and breeding to make more scorpions. By removing a wild scorpion you are negatively affecting it's environment just like the people killing them. And by "wild animals" I am including scorpions, spiders, and inverts, they are all animals.
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  7. DalilahBlue

    DalilahBlue Moderator 1,000+ Post Club

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    You might try making an area near your home hospitable to them. That way you can enjoy them, they are safe from other who may be uneducated, and they can still be wild.
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  8. Lioth

    Lioth New Member

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    You guys don't understand my point, my emps are living in an awesome place and I might have to show you a pic of their enclosure lol. I mean, the people here are not very interested in small inverts like tarantulas and scorpions because most of them are focusing on important things like food, family, and others. Besides, nobody likes keeping them in their houses and they still consider them dangerous even I've been convincing them that they're not, UNLESS you are allergic to the venom which is why we don't handle it. My goal is just to simply breed them in captivity without getting new wild ones, I hope we find a female for the guy we have here. I've seen people on YouTube collecting emps from the wild which is what I don't recommend you to do because they're going to get slowly endangered that way because they're only native to West Africa. As for the tarantulas, and other inverts I just wanted to ask if somebody here's a Wild Collector (and THEN breed them without getting new ones, that's where all CBs come and start from right?). I don't even pick up random inverts without studying about them; I've also freed a feather leg here before. Some people here do support me when I'm making an enclosure for them like bringing moist soil. ^^ nao I hope you understand or else Imma rage.
  9. DalilahBlue

    DalilahBlue Moderator 1,000+ Post Club

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    We understand where you are coming from. All CB inverts came from WC stock. Here in well developed countries, where most of us hail from, P. imps are plentiful and inexpensive. Even if they were native here most folks would still choose to buy CB due to the lessened likelihood of purchasing a specimen with parasites or disease and for the simple convenience.

    Let me give you another scenario. We have many Aphomopelmas here in the states. Even if I were to have everything ready it would not be as simple as catching a male and female. Are they truly the same specie, and if so, any considerations of subspecie to worry about? Is the female mature? If so, it would be best to wait til a bit after her next molt to ensure the best chances at a good egg sac. This genus is extremely slow growing and it could be years before she molts again. And what of my male in the mean time? Just let him hang out waiting on the female? He could be out courting wild ladies and making babies! But I am preventing him from that. Since a normal healthy looking T can be infested with parasites and disease he could easily die before my female is ready, thus depriving the wild populations of his genetic contributions.

    If you truly wish to breed to promote them in your local pet trade check a few things first. Are you prepared to spend the time, money, and effort that could easily become a decades long process? What happens if you move? Or relocate to another country? I am not sure of you age, but you seem to be fairly young. How will your plans for your future effect these animals? If you do end up with an extensive breeding operation what would happen to them if you became injured or sick and could not care for them?

    Are there any local or federal laws about what you wish to do? Any fees or licensing? Is it even legal in your area?

    After sufficiently pondering these considerations then ask yourself if you are prepared and willing, and still want, to do this...

    I hope this helps you understand the other side of the issue a little better. =^,^=
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  10. DalilahBlue

    DalilahBlue Moderator 1,000+ Post Club

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    And I know what it is like to live in an area where awesome animals are killed due to ignorance btw. Each year I risk my safety dozens of times to help snakes out of roadways. People see them and automatically think all snakes are bad and poisonous, when in fact we only have a few poisonous species here. Even of the poisonous ones, most bites occur when the snakes are provoked, or more commonly, stepped on. Very few of these bites are ever life threatening.

    But around here the general consensus is "the only good snake is a dead snake."
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  11. Lioth

    Lioth New Member

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    LOL! XD; Dalilah, that was funny and I think that is a nice answer but I would consider those a minor problem. I am from the Philippines and yes I do understand what you are saying a lot.

    I just want to clarify you some things before I start solving those issues you've said. In here, there are no local pet stores. There are no laws of legal and illegal keeping of scorpions and other inverts in here; they've not set a rule to it and I doubt that they have even thought about it. Before, people used to dislike it when I try to get scorpions, they don't want me to do that because they consider it harmful and I might be stung. I'm not a stubborn guy, but the thing is that I already knew what they were and what I could do for them. That was 3-4 months ago, so now people started to believe me while others still don't trust me; when I tried to get to them before nobody would help me, as if I'm trying to tell them to bring a crocodile when I'm only asking them to bring scorpions for me when they find one. It's kinda funny, but emps here are everywhere and I have a few people that accompany me with taking care of them. I've made them quite interested so far but it didn't happen quickly lol. If I ever leave this country, I would tell my friends to take care of them since I've already taught them what to do and what not to do. If that doesn't happen and there are absolutely no friends I can trust, then I might have to free them before I leave or simply use the remaining time I have to look for reliable friends that can take care of them, but that is quite difficult. As for the females, as I've told you, they are EVERYWHERE here but I have only one and only ONE emp in my house that I'm taking care of. I'll most likely find a female soon enough.

    As for me, I'm not going to make a pet store or a local pet trade something right now but I will probably do that when I grow older. I've already spent enough effort, time, and money for them even though most of my family members don't really support me much but they would help me as much as they can. If finding a female is hopeless and the date of my leaving of this country is near, I would free him to a far away moist land where no humans would live. It's not impossible to do. But if I free him here right in where I am now, he will most likely just get killed without even finding a female or a fellow specie. I have enough empirical evidence that the one I have right now is a P. imp. My first one was an adult and he had two missing legs before, which might have happened because somebody has injured it accidentally or purposely. I do not like making bad endings so I say I'm going to continue and do my best. I am very prepared of both sides, whether bad or good ends I would always have a good plan..
  12. Nada

    Nada Moderator 1,000+ Post Club

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    the problem here Lioth, is not the intention. It's the wording. You asked if any of us collect WC exclusively, because you do, and it would be awesome if we did too.
    If you find a scorpion and decide you want to keep it, that's fine, but if you keep taking them out of the wild, your hurting the species more than your helping it. You keep saying that if they were wild someone would just kill them(which may be true) but you also say that "they're everywhere" which suggests that they're doing just fine.
    If you find a wild bug and want to keep it, I don't agree, but it's not the end of the world, but don't do it to help the species. If you want to help the species; make as many people as aware of them as possible, but leave them in the wild.

    Just my 2 cents.
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  13. Lioth

    Lioth New Member

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    Not, not at all. My mistake over there. I am trying to keep only emperors, but what I meant to ask was that is there somebody out there in the world that are trying to collect wild invertebrates and then breed them in captivity so that we'll have our own captive bred species too? Well I thought it would be troublesome if make wild species in the world as pets. In that way it will obviously minimize their population. They are certainly everywhere in certain parts of West Africa but not in this country, so sorry about saying that they are everywhere because I was not inculding this country. In here, they are getting more and more endangered, of course I wouldn't say that without empirical evidence. I'm talking about, the best thing we do is that we get a male and female specimen so that they can reproduce each other. Of course it wouldn't be so easy and there might be more problems but to turn it simply; it should work. I'm not saying that I collect wild tarantulas and centipedes everywhere. I get the problem here, I was basically just saying that it would be awesome if somebody would be collecting wild scorpions for example and then breed them in captivity for pet trade without getting new wild scorpions and make their own pet trade or something. I am trying to that right now too but I'm not planning on making a pet shop, I'm just gonna keep them and then probably release the babies back to the wild when they grow enough when I can't think of anything more at all. I'm still gonna keep some of the CBs as pets until I go back home haha. That way at least it will increase their population a little bit. But not all babies are going to be saved because the mom devours some of them. I may have to edit the question though. :p
  14. Nada

    Nada Moderator 1,000+ Post Club

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    Seems like this was mostly a communication issue.
    I myself collect a couple tarantulas every year, breed them and release the slings and parents back into the wild.
    But I don't keep any WC animals.
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  15. Lioth

    Lioth New Member

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    In that case you might create a hybrid specie if the T is not native to your country, don't know if possible.
  16. Nada

    Nada Moderator 1,000+ Post Club

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    Oh, they're very native lol.
    The Tarantulas I collect are collected from the same location in Arizona, Bred, and returned to their original location. The only reason I do the breeding myself is to get the slings to 2nd instar and help the survival rate.
  17. Lioth

    Lioth New Member

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    What's it called? I think that there are Arizona bark scorpions there in AZ so be careful bro.
  18. Nada

    Nada Moderator 1,000+ Post Club

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    There are a bunch of different species here. And the Scorps here are no big deal.
  19. DalilahBlue

    DalilahBlue Moderator 1,000+ Post Club

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    They may have some gnarly side effects from the sting but deaths are rare. Mostly from allergic reaction, or due to the victim being a small child or adult with a compromised immune system.
  20. DalilahBlue

    DalilahBlue Moderator 1,000+ Post Club

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    The Aphonopelma genus primarily I believe.