- Messages
- 1,729
- Location
- The arm pit of The United States
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B.Smithi name change is on the books now
- Thread starter IamKrush
- Start date
- Messages
- 1,729
- Location
- The arm pit of The United States
- Messages
- 11,039
- Location
- Malton, UK
It still says it's proposed though.
- Messages
- 1,729
- Location
- The arm pit of The United States
- Messages
- 1,729
- Location
- The arm pit of The United States
Apprently it just was made offical a few days ago
- Messages
- 5,547
- Location
- Outside San Antonio, TX
It doesn't seem right..smithi has been smithi a long time. Few name changes have irritated me this much..
- Messages
- 1,729
- Location
- The arm pit of The United States
I think alot of people feel the same.
- Messages
- 49
I am confused. The first paper's abstract above said that smithi and hamorii were redescribed and that annitha is to be included in smithi. I did not read the full paper (call me cheap for not wanting to pay $40 for it), but the abstract sounds like smithi is still smithi, hamorii is still hamorii, and annitha is now smithi.
Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk
Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk
that's what i got out of it. I won't pay to read a paper i only understand 2% of either
This link still shows the 2 as separate, and anitha a synonym of smithi.
- Messages
- 49
OK, having just read a thread on this on AB (in which the paper's author posts), I think some of my confusion is clearing.
It is not that they are reclassifying B. smithi as B. hamorii, it is that many/ most specimens in the hobby are in fact B. hamorii.
So B. smithi is still B. smithi, but many people actually have B. hamorii.
I have to wait a week to go home and look over my 10 "smithis" and figure out if any are actually smithi.
It is not that they are reclassifying B. smithi as B. hamorii, it is that many/ most specimens in the hobby are in fact B. hamorii.
So B. smithi is still B. smithi, but many people actually have B. hamorii.
I have to wait a week to go home and look over my 10 "smithis" and figure out if any are actually smithi.
- Messages
- 5,547
- Location
- Outside San Antonio, TX
WSC has the full paper from what I heard Tom say. You just have to register on that site, its quick he said.
- Messages
- 49
I have now registered, but still am not able to download.
Will try again tomorrow.
Will try again tomorrow.
Have just read, about this, where it is written in Spanish. A good read along with photos.
From what I can gather, Brachypelma annitha will cease to be used (or, IOW, name will cease to exist).
Instead, the Brachypelma annitha is now known as Brachypelma smithi.
Many (most) in the hobby, that we know as Brachypelma smithi, are actually Brachypelma hamorii and are to be named such.
That said, keep in mind that some specimens, named B. smithi (in the hobby), could actually be what is/was known as B. annitha but are/were, mistakenly, named "smithi".
This means one must look their "hobby smithi" specimen over since, while the majority will likely be hamorii, it all depends on their phenotype, &/or difference in spermatheca, as to whether they are, now, smithi (formerly known as annitha) or hamorii.
Sure hope what I wrote makes sense. LoL
If/When I find time, I'll see about translating, to English, unless I can find the/an English version.
If I don't get around to translating the writing, I may just post pics with info/explanation.
This is, of course, unless someone else beats me to it (in posting the info/paper).
From what I can gather, Brachypelma annitha will cease to be used (or, IOW, name will cease to exist).
Instead, the Brachypelma annitha is now known as Brachypelma smithi.
Many (most) in the hobby, that we know as Brachypelma smithi, are actually Brachypelma hamorii and are to be named such.
That said, keep in mind that some specimens, named B. smithi (in the hobby), could actually be what is/was known as B. annitha but are/were, mistakenly, named "smithi".
This means one must look their "hobby smithi" specimen over since, while the majority will likely be hamorii, it all depends on their phenotype, &/or difference in spermatheca, as to whether they are, now, smithi (formerly known as annitha) or hamorii.
Sure hope what I wrote makes sense. LoL
If/When I find time, I'll see about translating, to English, unless I can find the/an English version.
If I don't get around to translating the writing, I may just post pics with info/explanation.
This is, of course, unless someone else beats me to it (in posting the info/paper).
Mine will remain smithi, i'm to lazy to change the labels. just like my avic is still an avic and not the ybygyby thing.
- Messages
- 5,547
- Location
- Outside San Antonio, TX
Rofl, we complain about how much work needs to be done in taxonomy, then we ***** when they change something Ahh well. Hamorii. Easy enough. Next they'll scramble Phormictopus around, and half of them will be moved to Xenopoopicus flurfijoo.
Ahh well. Hamorii. Easy enough. Next they'll scramble Phormictopus around, and half of them will be moved to Xenopoopicus flurfijoo.
- Messages
- 127
- Location
- the great north west
Can some one explain this in layman terms, I'm just a hobiest.
Did they publish side by side pictures?
Did they publish side by side pictures?
- Messages
- 5,547
- Location
- Outside San Antonio, TX
What the paper says is basically, the spider we've been calling B smithi is not the originally described B smithi, its a B hamorii. Dont dwell on it too much
- Messages
- 127
- Location
- the great north west
What the paper says is basically, the spider we've been calling B smithi is not the originally described B smithi, its a B hamorii. Dont dwell on it too much
Attachments
Translation will have to wait, or be put aside (due to time/energy constraints), but I summed up what was there in my previous post.
The rest was regarding identification and locality. Pretty much what accompanied the photos that I am posting here.
Distribution - Mexico:
B. smithi (formerly annitha)- Guerrero.
B. hamorii - Jalisco, Colima, and Michoacan.
In the first pic (set of four) is the Brachypelma smithi (formerly annitha):
#19 is an adult male Brachypelma smithi. It has a carapace coloration like that of the Brachypelma Boehmei.
#20 & #21 is the typical carapace coloration.
#22 is a specimen with a carapace coloration that is similar to the B. hamorii. Which makes identification more complicated via color alone.
In the second pic (set of four) is the Brachypelma hamorii (what we, in the hobby, are accustomed to knowing as the Brachypelma smithi):
#37 is an adult male. Carapace looks somewhat similar to smithi ("annitha")
#38 & #39 is the typical carapace coloration.
#40 is a specimen with a non-typical hamorii coloration of carapace.
As can be seen, B. smithi (formerly annitha) can have a carapace coloration variant that is similar to the B. hamorii and, likewise, the B. hamorii can have a carapace coloration variant similar to the B. smithi (formerly annitha).
These variants could, possibly, be due to hybridization via hobby breeding.
However, the legs can really help with identification. Even with those that possess conflicting color variations.
Third pic is of B. smithi (formerly annitha) legs:
Note the intensity of the red & orange and that they do not mix with the black. Colors have a "crisper" appearance than those of the B. hamorii.
Fourth pic is of B. hamorii legs:
Note the long hairs and the orange & cream colors, on the knees, which the smithi/"annitha" lacks.
The orange colors are paler, than those of the smithi/"annitha", and the orange (& perhaps some cream), on the tibia, mixes (or diffuses) into the black.
The rest was regarding identification and locality. Pretty much what accompanied the photos that I am posting here.
Distribution - Mexico:
B. smithi (formerly annitha)- Guerrero.
B. hamorii - Jalisco, Colima, and Michoacan.
In the first pic (set of four) is the Brachypelma smithi (formerly annitha):
#19 is an adult male Brachypelma smithi. It has a carapace coloration like that of the Brachypelma Boehmei.
#20 & #21 is the typical carapace coloration.
#22 is a specimen with a carapace coloration that is similar to the B. hamorii. Which makes identification more complicated via color alone.
In the second pic (set of four) is the Brachypelma hamorii (what we, in the hobby, are accustomed to knowing as the Brachypelma smithi):
#37 is an adult male. Carapace looks somewhat similar to smithi ("annitha")
#38 & #39 is the typical carapace coloration.
#40 is a specimen with a non-typical hamorii coloration of carapace.
As can be seen, B. smithi (formerly annitha) can have a carapace coloration variant that is similar to the B. hamorii and, likewise, the B. hamorii can have a carapace coloration variant similar to the B. smithi (formerly annitha).
These variants could, possibly, be due to hybridization via hobby breeding.
However, the legs can really help with identification. Even with those that possess conflicting color variations.
Third pic is of B. smithi (formerly annitha) legs:
Note the intensity of the red & orange and that they do not mix with the black. Colors have a "crisper" appearance than those of the B. hamorii.
Fourth pic is of B. hamorii legs:
Note the long hairs and the orange & cream colors, on the knees, which the smithi/"annitha" lacks.
The orange colors are paler, than those of the smithi/"annitha", and the orange (& perhaps some cream), on the tibia, mixes (or diffuses) into the black.
Attachments
Last edited:
These pics were from another source re. this topic.
First pic is of the B. smithi (formerly annitha).
Second pic is the spermatheca of the B. smithi (formerly annitha).
Third pic is of the B. hamorii.
Fourth pic is the spermatheca of the B. hamorii.
First pic is of the B. smithi (formerly annitha).
Second pic is the spermatheca of the B. smithi (formerly annitha).
Third pic is of the B. hamorii.
Fourth pic is the spermatheca of the B. hamorii.
