Curly Hair Advixe

[bigdave1986]

Hi folks

New to site sorry if this is posted in the wrong section.

I have a curly hair female who is 6-7cm in a large spider shop enclosure (this is what I was told to use) it’s 32x22x21. Someone told me the spider leg span x 1.5 is what I need to stop any fatal falls I.e the height from substrate to yeah top of enclosure Is this correct as when I put that much substrate in it looks very excessive.

I just want to make sure she is safe and she isn’t overwhelmed by too much substrate.

Sorry for the daft question

Dave

 

[Aracnoenthusiast]

1.5 x the leg span is a good rule for height from substrate to top

 

[bigdave1986]

Thanks very much for the reply back much appreciated

 

[Stan Schultz]

New to site sorry if this is posted in the wrong section.

Correct section.

I have a curly hair female who is 6-7cm in a large spider shop enclosure

My condolences. I don't see a photo of your setup, but if it's anything like most of what I've seen in pet shops, you blew far too much cash on a cage that's only marginally acceptable. A five gallon aquarium (16 x 8 x 10 inches = 42 x 20.5 x 25.4 cm, 22.7 L - All these are just approximations) with a sturdy mesh cover is plenty big for a curlyhair (Tliltocatl albopilosus) and probably a lot less expensive. And glass aquariums don't scratch and get blurry like plastic cages do. And, if you're a newbie, you shouldn't be trying to keep a tarantula in an "environmental" cage. All that scenery, junk, and even live plants is only for your personal gratification. The tarantula really couldn't care less. All that stuff is something that gets in the way when the spider tries to move around its cage, and a good place for crickets to hide, die, and stink. Learn to take proper care of your tarantula first, then gradually learn how to set up a simple, low key environmental cage after a year or so.

(this is what I was told to use) it’s 32x22x21. Someone told me the spider leg span x 1.5 is what I need to stop any fatal falls I.e the height from substrate to yeah top of enclosure Is this correct as when I put that much substrate in it looks very excessive.

The "1.5" rule describes the MINIMUM

I just want to make sure she is safe and she isn’t overwhelmed by too much substrate.

Sorry for the daft question

Dave

 

[Stan Schultz]

Correct section.



My condolences. I don't see a photo of your setup, but if it's anything like most of what I've seen in pet shops, you blew far too much cash on a cage that's only marginally acceptable. A five gallon aquarium (16 x 8 x 10 inches = 42 x 20.5 x 25.4 cm, 22.7 L - All these are just approximations) with a sturdy mesh cover is plenty big for a curlyhair (Tliltocatl albopilosus) and probably a lot less expensive. And glass aquariums don't scratch and get blurry like plastic cages do. And, if you're a newbie, you shouldn't be trying to keep a tarantula in an "environmental" cage. All that scenery, junk, and even live plants is only for your personal gratification. The tarantula really couldn't care less. All that stuff is something that gets in the way when the spider tries to move around its cage, and a good place for crickets to hide, die, and stink. Learn to take proper care of your tarantula first, then gradually learn how to set up a simple, low key environmental cage after a year or so.



The "1.5" rule describes the MINIMUM

Oops! Sorry! I accidentally hit some sort of "send" trigger. Here's the continuation of my post.

The "1.5" rule is used to delineate two aspects of cage size.

1) The shorter dimension of the cage floor should be AT LEAST 1.5 times the tarantula's DLS (Diagonal leg span) for a rectangular cage, with the longer dimension AT LEAST 1.5 times that. And the diameter should be AT LEAST 3 times the DLS if you're using a cylindrical, hexagonal or octagonal cage. There is no standardized upper limit, however. (After all, your curlyhair, had it been of wild nativity, would have all of Central America to get lost in!)

2) The clear space between the top of the substrate and the top of the cage SHOULD NOT exceed 1.5 times the DLS for an adult, terrestrial tarantula (as opposed to an arboreal species - see also the note immediately below). Tarantulas up to one-quarter to one-third the adult DLS can tolerate more head room, however. Furthermore, the ideal substrate depth is open to much discussion and controversy with enthusiasts voicing all sorts of baseless opinions and beliefs, but little actual data in support. In reality, tarantulas, being highly adaptable and hardy creatures under most circumstances, really don't care a lot. Again! Literally thousands upon thousands of tarantulas have been kept in cages with only a bare skiff of substrate up to a truly, ridiculously thick pile of it. And they seem to do just fine. Because very few tarantula kinds actually NEED a lot of substrate in which to burrow (to my knowledge, only the African king baboon tarantula, Pelinobius (Citharischius) muticus, and the cobalt blue tarantula, Cyriopagopus (Haplopelma) lividus, are in this group) it's more a matter of your preference. When you consider that, in nature, the substrate goes at least deep enough to hit bedrock, and potentially the Earth's center (just short of 4,000 miles - 6440 km - straight down), the whole issue becomes a bit silly. Practice has shown that a layer of substrate about 1.5 inches (about 4 cm) is a practical depth for almost all purposes. But if you need to, go wild!

[Note: Enthusiasts and a few professional arachnologists have taken to using the term "fossorial" in the same sense as terrestrial, but the two terms have slightly different meanings. "Terrestrial" means "of the Earth," where "Earth' can mean either planet Earth or ground, or dirt. And terrestrial can be used with almost any organism.

"Fossorial," on the other hand, is properly used only with certain mammals that live their entire lives underground, seldom, if ever, coming to the surface. The naked mole-rat of Africa, Heterocephalus glaber, is often given as an example. Tarantulas are neither mammals, nor do they spend their entire lives underground (with the exception of a few cave dwelling species).]

I just want to make sure she is safe and she isn’t overwhelmed by too much substrate.

Out of curiosity, what leads you to believe that tarantulas can be overwhelmed by anything? In fact, what does "overwhelm" even mean in this context?

To fully appreciate a tarantula you must understand at a very fundamental level that they are nothing like any other animal you have ever kept as a pet. Almost all the rules that you learned about caring for goldfish, gerbils, parakeets, even reptiles don't apply, and may even be lethal to your newfound, little buddy. Spiders, tarantulas included, might as well have evolved on some alien planet, their differences from 99% of the rest of Earth's animals are at least that profound. There are only two reasons for any similarity between them and any other creatures you've ever heard about:

1) Something like two-thirds of a billion years ago, both spiders (actually arachnids in general) and all other animal life on Earth shared a common ancestor. After that, with the single exception of the next point, they did their own thing, and we did ours. They had THAT long a period of time to become different from us, and to solve all the problems of surviving everything that "Mother Nature" could throw at them in some truly unique ways.

2) They had to rely on the rest of the life on planet Earth as a source of food and oxygen. So they could evolve to be as wildly bizarre as possible as long as they could still catch, eat, digest, and metabolize the other animals (and sometimes plants) around them. Show a little reverence, please, to your newfound little buddy!

I hope that this story helps give you some idea of how special and fantastic a creature you're keeping as "just a pet spider."

(See the last paragraph, below.)

Sorry for the daft question.

No, no, no! That's okay! The only really silly, stupid, or daft questions are the ones you don't ask. Fire at will!

Lastly, may I be so bold as to recommend that you check out a copy of the Tarantula Keeper's Guide from your local public library. (I can freely recommend it publicly now because it's out of print and I'm no longer enjoying royalties from its sale.) Do not try to read it cover to cover in one sitting. There's about 376 pages of tarantula drivel there. That's been known to cause brain damage! Instead, take your time, look at the photos, read their captions, read those paragraphs or topics that catch your eye. If you have to check out a copy two or three times to read it all, go for it. Ultimately, if you'd like your own copy, search for used copies from the various Internet used book stores.

(Digital copies of TKG3 are still available from Amazon and Barnes and Noble over the Internet, but apparently I'm no longer getting royalties from their sale.)

Enjoy, cheers, and best of luck!

Stan

 

[bigdave1986]

Oops! Sorry! I accidentally hit some sort of "send" trigger. Here's the continuation of my post.

The "1.5" rule is used to delineate two aspects of cage size.

1) The shorter dimension of the cage floor should be AT LEAST 1.5 times the tarantula's DLS (Diagonal leg span) for a rectangular cage, with the longer dimension AT LEAST 1.5 times that. And the diameter should be AT LEAST 3 times the DLS if you're using a cylindrical, hexagonal or octagonal cage. There is no standardized upper limit, however. (After all, your curlyhair, had it been of wild nativity, would have all of Central America to get lost in!)

2) The clear space between the top of the substrate and the top of the cage SHOULD NOT exceed 1.5 times the DLS for an adult, terrestrial tarantula (as opposed to an arboreal species - see also the note immediately below). Tarantulas up to one-quarter to one-third the adult DLS can tolerate more head room, however. Furthermore, the ideal substrate depth is open to much discussion and controversy with enthusiasts voicing all sorts of baseless opinions and beliefs, but little actual data in support. In reality, tarantulas, being highly adaptable and hardy creatures under most circumstances, really don't care a lot. Again! Literally thousands upon thousands of tarantulas have been kept in cages with only a bare skiff of substrate up to a truly, ridiculously thick pile of it. And they seem to do just fine. Because very few tarantula kinds actually NEED a lot of substrate in which to burrow (to my knowledge, only the African king baboon tarantula, Pelinobius (Citharischius) muticus, and the cobalt blue tarantula, Cyriopagopus (Haplopelma) lividus, are in this group) it's more a matter of your preference. When you consider that, in nature, the substrate goes at least deep enough to hit bedrock, and potentially the Earth's center (just short of 4,000 miles - 6440 km - straight down), the whole issue becomes a bit silly. Practice has shown that a layer of substrate about 1.5 inches (about 4 cm) is a practical depth for almost all purposes. But if you need to, go wild!

[Note: Enthusiasts and a few professional arachnologists have taken to using the term "fossorial" in the same sense as terrestrial, but the two terms have slightly different meanings. "Terrestrial" means "of the Earth," where "Earth' can mean either planet Earth or ground, or dirt. And terrestrial can be used with almost any organism.

"Fossorial," on the other hand, is properly used only with certain mammals that live their entire lives underground, seldom, if ever, coming to the surface. The naked mole-rat of Africa, Heterocephalus glaber, is often given as an example. Tarantulas are neither mammals, nor do they spend their entire lives underground (with the exception of a few cave dwelling species).]




Out of curiosity, what leads you to believe that tarantulas can be overwhelmed by anything? In fact, what does "overwhelm" even mean in this context?

To fully appreciate a tarantula you must understand at a very fundamental level that they are nothing like any other animal you have ever kept as a pet. Almost all the rules that you learned about caring for goldfish, gerbils, parakeets, even reptiles don't apply, and may even be lethal to your newfound, little buddy. Spiders, tarantulas included, might as well have evolved on some alien planet, their differences from 99% of the rest of Earth's animals are at least that profound. There are only two reasons for any similarity between them and any other creatures you've ever heard about:

1) Something like two-thirds of a billion years ago, both spiders (actually arachnids in general) and all other animal life on Earth shared a common ancestor. After that, with the single exception of the next point, they did their own thing, and we did ours. They had THAT long a period of time to become different from us, and to solve all the problems of surviving everything that "Mother Nature" could throw at them in some truly unique ways.

2) They had to rely on the rest of the life on planet Earth as a source of food and oxygen. So they could evolve to be as wildly bizarre as possible as long as they could still catch, eat, digest, and metabolize the other animals (and sometimes plants) around them. Show a little reverence, please, to your newfound little buddy!

I hope that this story helps give you some idea of how special and fantastic a creature you're keeping as "just a pet spider."

(See the last paragraph, below.)



No, no, no! That's okay! The only really silly, stupid, or daft questions are the ones you don't ask. Fire at will!

Lastly, may I be so bold as to recommend that you check out a copy of the Tarantula Keeper's Guide from your local public library. (I can freely recommend it publicly now because it's out of print and I'm no longer enjoying royalties from its sale.) Do not try to read it cover to cover in one sitting. There's about 376 pages of tarantula drivel there. That's been known to cause brain damage! Instead, take your time, look at the photos, read their captions, read those paragraphs or topics that catch your eye. If you have to check out a copy two or three times to read it all, go for it. Ultimately, if you'd like your own copy, search for used copies from the various Internet used book stores.

(Digital copies of TKG3 are still available from Amazon and Barnes and Noble over the Internet, but apparently I'm no longer getting royalties from their sale.)

Enjoy, cheers, and best of luck!

Stan

 

[bigdave1986]

Hi Stan

Thanks for that

The enclosure was actually the size the spider shop uk recommended and it comes with all the 6-7 cm tarantulas.

I just meant overwhelmed as in burrowing herself and not managing to get out.

I don’t have much in the enclosure just a hide and a water bowl i was told to keep it basic same as my nhandu which I have had since October

Appreciate your help

David