Hamorii or Smithi?

[spodermin]

Is this brachypelma hamorii or smithi or a hybrid? I'm 99% sure hamorii but it looks different enough from my other hamorii I figure I should ask before breeding an abomination

 

[Arachnoclown]

Hamorii

 

[spodermin]

Hamorii

Yes thank you, I forgot to update this. Right after I posted this I looked again at my other specimen and they're all but identical

 

[FishermanSteve]

Hamorii

Do you know any references to the visual differences between the two? I’ll admit I don’t really know the difference

 

[plessey]

13868_Mendoza_&_Francke_2017_Inv_31_157_179

MediaFire is a simple to use free service that lets you put all your photos, documents, music, and video in a single place so you can access them anywhere and share them everywhere.

www.mediafire.com

 

[Jess S]

Is this brachypelma hamorii or smithi or a hybrid? I'm 99% sure hamorii but it looks different enough from my other hamorii I figure I should ask before breeding an abomination

Wow, exciting to hear you're breeding hamorri. Hope it goes well and I'm really looking forward to seeing any updates

 

[Arachnoclown]

Do you know any references to the visual differences between the two? I’ll admit I don’t really know the difference

I do but the photos are not mine and I would need permission to share. The main thing for me is the Chelicerae...smithi Chelicerae are mostly black with very, very little brown. @sdsnybny has some photos he might share.

 

[PanzoN88]

I do but the photos are not mine and I would need permission to share. The main thing for me is the Chelicerae...smithi Chelicerae are mostly black with very, very little brown. @sdsnybny has some photos he might share.

There is a great thread on ab from a few years ago that had good photos and details of the difference between the two species. Only problems are I can't remember the name of the thread and the author disappeared off the face of the internet, even Instagram and Facebook.

 

[spodermin]

There is a great thread on ab from a few years ago that had good photos and details oher f the difference between the two species. Only problems are I can't remember the name of the thread and the author disappeared off the face of the internet, even Instagram and Facebook.

Yeah I couldn't find it either which is why I made this post

 

[Jess S]

Apart from a lighter band of hair on the chelicerae of the majority of hamorri, here's some other differences.
Smithi: red knees (patella)
Hamorri: orange knees
Smithi: side of patella mainly orange
Hamorri: side of patella mainly black
Smithi: longer hair on legs yellow
Hamorri: longer hair on legs dark

 

[plessey]

The link I posted earlier is for the paper - Systematic revision of Brachypelma red-kneed tarantulas (Araneae : Theraphosidae), and the use of DNA barcodes to assist in the identification and conservation of CITES-listed species by Jorge Mendoza and Oscar Francke. This has all the photos and descriptions you need.

 

[Jess S]

The link I posted earlier is for the paper - Systematic revision of Brachypelma red-kneed tarantulas (Araneae : Theraphosidae), and the use of DNA barcodes to assist in the identification and conservation of CITES-listed species by Jorge Mendoza and Oscar Francke. This has all the photos and descriptions you need.

Apologies, I'm going to click the link now that I've finished work. I've got as my reference the Identification of CITES Listed document that I believe was put together for Customs officials and wildlife workers, pre the change to Tlitocatl though it does reference an upcoming name change for the affected species. The study you provided the link to is what info in this document is based on so I'm looking forward to reading it. Hopefully I'll understand at least some of it! Thanks for sharing it.

 

[Arachnoclown]

The link I posted earlier is for the paper - Systematic revision of Brachypelma red-kneed tarantulas (Araneae : Theraphosidae), and the use of DNA barcodes to assist in the identification and conservation of CITES-listed species by Jorge Mendoza and Oscar Francke. This has all the photos and descriptions you need.

Link didnt work...my phones virus protection shut it down.

 

[Arachnoclown]

Photos owned by Jose Berrios
These photos are un-edited with no color enhancements. if your spider doesnt look like this it's not a smithi.

 

[plessey]

Link didnt work...my phones virus protection shut it down.

Here you go

 

[sdsnybny]

Here is the link to the FB post with the visual differences, you cant go by carapace coloration as there are variation within both. Make sure you look at all the photos. For me its the vibrant orange (smithi) versus the duller coloration of hamorii as well as the almost all black setae on the smithi chelicerae with just a few long accent hairs that are tan.

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