A polite rant

[MassExodus]

This post is for new hobbyists. I'm Waylon, I've been keeping tarantulas for 8 years or so. I've learned many things about them, but I'm by no means an expert. There are people in this forum with FAR more knowledge than I. I can only speak from my own experiences keeping all kinds of tarantulas. Consider me the average keeper. There's my disclaimer
If you come into this hobby wanting an obt, a poeci, or another of the "hotter" old world species, I have some advice I'd like to share.
If you're an intelligent adult, and don't have an irrational fear of spiders, then do your research. Watch videos, read blogs, posts, etc, until you've learned all the info you can on that species, and buy the damned spider! If you go on a forum and say "hi, I'm new to tarantulas, and I'm getting a poeci!" You will be inundated with discouraging comments, and on one particular forum, flayed alive and salted. Many of these comments will be from people just repeating what has been beaten into them by the dissaproving masses, who don't even have practical experience with the species in question. Read. Research. Watch videos, they're very important tools for learning.
(I often think that this fearful attitude is brought to this hobby by arachnophobes who use tarantulas to cure their illness. Perhaps not phobics, but just people who keep animals they fear? Dunno, but it pisses me off.)
Now, if you DO fear spiders, and close interactions with them, then perhaps the "ladder system" IS right for you. Get a Brachypelma or something to start with. Personally, I like them better than poecis, hell, better than ANY old world spider..yes, I mean it.
Anyways, what I'm saying is do your thing, don't be discouraged by dire warnings from the fearful. All the info you need, to keep any tarantula available in this hobby, is at your fingertips. Oh, one more thing. Learn the proper names of spiders. It's very important to do so. Don't buy a "Chaco golden knee" buy a Grammastola pulchripes. Identification is very important, in every instance of reading about, speaking about, posting about, and especially buying tarantulas. Besides, some guy selling imports doesn't deserve the honor of naming these beauties. Naturalists and taxonomists that discover them do!
I hope this helps some of you. Don't fear these gorgeous creatures, but by all means respect them. If not..well, I always enjoy a good bite report. Lmao.

 

[Nunua]

I felt a sharp stab in my heart, because I'm one of those people who tend to warn about OWs even though I'm just a very new hobbyist myself with nothing but an Acanthoscurria geniculata and a Neoholothei incei gold.. So yes, you got me there - No experience, only things I've researched myself. I had to read through my comments in one thread, and saw that I could have formed every single message in a different way. Oh well, can't change the past, only be more open and careful in the future.

Anyway, your post wasn't about a one single member, so let's leave my own conscience aside

No matter what I have said earlier, in the end I agree with your point of getting whatever species if a person truly feels ready for that. I also like that you mention the importance of proper research, especially videos - No matter how well someone describes the speed of a T or tendency of throwing a threat pose, the way to understand a description varies between each individual. Therefore, it's better to combine these descriptions with videos and actually combine the data in your head to get a much better general view.

About the reason for fearful and dire comments.. Yes, you are probably somewhat right about the reasons of shooting down those, who introduce themselves by saying that they're new and getting a poeci / OBT / whateverOW... However, I think that one other reason may be those people, who are getting an OW just because it's "cool to own a more dangerous spider, not a lazy pet rock". Then again, that's not a good reason to shoot down an individual without knowing if they're actually an intelligent adult or just a douche who want to make cool videos to YouTube - and well, even if they're just a douche with bad attitude, it'd be better to at least try to give 'em a gently push towards the proper research. Otherwise they may get an OW just to show at everyone

Lastly, yes, I could't agree more about learning the scientific names. I believe that proper identification is essential not only for research, but understanding the species and this hobby overall. Ok, I'm a microbiologist trainee, so the scientific identification is very close to my heart, heh!

 

[MassExodus]

That was most definitely not directed at you. I apologize for being an ass in your other thread, that was just built up frustration at the hobby attitude towards new keepers in general. I don't like to edit or delete my posts, but I think I will that one. And you're right, there's plenty of buffoons that want to get a "badass old world" just to show off. But if you think about it, those kind of people are going to do dumb stuff no matter what any of us say. I just feel like encouragement is severely lacking in this hobby. I'm glad you understand what I'm trying to say

 

[Nunua]

No worries, I definitely did not feel that this post was directed to any particular individual but I was extremely happy that it made me to think and reflect my own behavior. So, well done!
And tbh, I never though you being an ass towards me - I have had similar frustration built ups in a different hobby, so I know the feeling very well. We are adults, so we can discuss things through and learn from the process.

 

[Dave Jay]

Being in Australia I have no choice but to start with old world s

This post is for new hobbyists. I'm Waylon, I've been keeping tarantulas for 8 years or so. I've learned many things about them, but I'm by no means an expert. There are people in this forum with FAR more knowledge than I. I can only speak from my own experiences keeping all kinds of tarantulas. Consider me the average keeper. There's my disclaimer
If you come into this hobby wanting an obt, a poeci, or another of the "hotter" old world species, I have some advice I'd like to share.
If you're an intelligent adult, and don't have an irrational fear of spiders, then do your research. Watch videos, read blogs, posts, etc, until you've learned all the info you can on that species, and buy the damned spider! If you go on a forum and say "hi, I'm new to tarantulas, and I'm getting a poeci!" You will be inundated with discouraging comments, and on one particular forum, flayed alive and salted. Many of these comments will be from people just repeating what has been beaten into them by the dissaproving masses, who don't even have practical experience with the species in question. Read. Research. Watch videos, they're very important tools for learning.
(I often think that this fearful attitude is brought to this hobby by arachnophobes who use tarantulas to cure their illness. Perhaps not phobics, but just people who keep animals they fear? Dunno, but it pisses me off.)
Now, if you DO fear spiders, and close interactions with them, then perhaps the "ladder system" IS right for you. Get a Brachypelma or something to start with. Personally, I like them better than poecis, hell, better than ANY old world spider..yes, I mean it.
Anyways, what I'm saying is do your thing, don't be discouraged by dire warnings from the fearful. All the info you need, to keep any tarantula available in this hobby, is at your fingertips. Oh, one more thing. Learn the proper names of spiders. It's very important to do so. Don't buy a "Chaco golden knee" buy a Grammastola pulchripes. Identification is very important, in every instance of reading about, speaking about, posting about, and especially buying tarantulas. Besides, some guy selling imports doesn't deserve the honor of naming these beauties. Naturalists and taxonomists that discover them do!
I hope this helps some of you. Don't fear these gorgeous creatures, but by all means respect them. If not..well, I always enjoy a good bite report. Lmao.

Being in Australia I had no choice but to start with old world tarantulas. All I could/can do is research, and start with slings/juvies to gain some experience and confidence before dealing with full grown tarantulas. I have had some interaction some in the outback I realise now, and know that they will jump towards you rather than away if you approach them if they are in the open.
I have never been comfortable handling spiders, but I don't have a phobia of them, just a healthy respect imo.
So I am following the rules, using tongs and 'poker' inside the enclosure, never hands even if the spider is not visible.
I have everything prepared and ready before opening an enclosure to minimise the time the lid is open.
There is always a catching cup ready before a lid is opened.
I move a lamp over so there is enough light to both see what I am doing and to see the area around me in case of escape.
All my lids are taped on both front and back and the tape checked before bed if feeding or maintenance has been done that day.
The enclosures are secure in shelving and can't be knocked over.
The household and regular visitors are informed and aware of what I am keeping where and how venomous the various inverts are, one because I don't want them messing with them, and two so they know to let me know asap if something looks amiss.

I'm not very worried about getting bitten myself, hopefully I'll never be that careless and I don't plan to handle them ever. I know of 4 species of spider living in my house or yard that have bites as serious or worse as the tarantulas, apart from the physical damage , so I can't really worry about that too much , I'm more likely to get tagged in the yard lifting pot plants or gardening etc. However, the tarantulas bite being fatal to dogs or cats is something that worries me, I would have to board them in the case of an escape if the spider couldn't be found quickly I guess, but it just means being extra careful with the lids.

I feel that the risks don't outweigh the benefits of being able to observe these amazing creatures, or the various thrills that accompany any rewarding hobby.

 

[Enn49]

I am one of those who had a an irrational fear of spiders, I still don't like them running round in the house. I had kept snakes of various temperaments, some rear fanged, and felt I was careful enough to buy the T I wanted not what I was advised to buy so my first T was an OBT. I had read all about their bad reputation but as I had no intention of handling her, I took the plunge and got slated for my action. My second T was a Pokie, more slating, but neither ever gave me a reason to regret my decision. Sadly my OBT has passed on but that Pokie is now probably the calmest T I have.
I would never condemn anyone for beginning in the hobby at the wrong end of the "ladder" as I did exactly that but I will always say that research and respect is a necessity.

 

[MassExodus]

Being in Australia I have no choice but to start with old world s

Being in Australia I had no choice but to start with old world tarantulas. All I could/can do is research, and start with slings/juvies to gain some experience and confidence before dealing with full grown tarantulas. I have had some interaction some in the outback I realise now, and know that they will jump towards you rather than away if you approach them if they are in the open.
I have never been comfortable handling spiders, but I don't have a phobia of them, just a healthy respect imo.
So I am following the rules, using tongs and 'poker' inside the enclosure, never hands even if the spider is not visible.
I have everything prepared and ready before opening an enclosure to minimise the time the lid is open.
There is always a catching cup ready before a lid is opened.
I move a lamp over so there is enough light to both see what I am doing and to see the area around me in case of escape.
All my lids are taped on both front and back and the tape checked before bed if feeding or maintenance has been done that day.
The enclosures are secure in shelving and can't be knocked over.
The household and regular visitors are informed and aware of what I am keeping where and how venomous the various inverts are, one because I don't want them messing with them, and two so they know to let me know asap if something looks amiss.

I'm not very worried about getting bitten myself, hopefully I'll never be that careless and I don't plan to handle them ever. I know of 4 species of spider living in my house or yard that have bites as serious or worse as the tarantulas, apart from the physical damage , so I can't really worry about that too much , I'm more likely to get tagged in the yard lifting pot plants or gardening etc. However, the tarantulas bite being fatal to dogs or cats is something that worries me, I would have to board them in the case of an escape if the spider couldn't be found quickly I guess, but it just means being extra careful with the lids.

I feel that the risks don't outweigh the benefits of being able to observe these amazing creatures, or the various thrills that accompany any rewarding hobby.

Well said. Personally I couldn't keep a whistler..I admire my spiders very much, but my dogs are truly my best friends. I'd worry constantly, even taking the precautions you do. I still worry. There may be a NW that's in the hobby and deadly to dogs, and we just don't know it. +1 on keeping enclosures secure, at all times.

 

[MassExodus]

I am one of those who had a an irrational fear of spiders, I still don't like them running round in the house. I had kept snakes of various temperaments, some rear fanged, and felt I was careful enough to buy the T I wanted not what I was advised to buy so my first T was an OBT. I had read all about their bad reputation but as I had no intention of handling her, I took the plunge and got slated for my action. My second T was a Pokie, more slating, but neither ever gave me a reason to regret my decision. Sadly my OBT has passed on but that Pokie is now probably the calmest T I have.
I would never condemn anyone for beginning in the hobby at the wrong end of the "ladder" as I did exactly that but I will always say that research and respect is a necessity.

I'd forgotten that about you Enn. But you raised a bunch of Phiddipus didn't you? You never held one? Granted, they jump out of your hands almost always, but they drop a bungee line first. I've handled most species of wolf and jumper in my area, never got tagged. You should try it, I think it would help
Next thing you know, you'll have them living in your bedroom, free roaming, like I do I picked up a P audax in the ER and people were horrified. Then they all moved closer to look at the little beauty. (After playing yo yo with him til he stayed still, lol)

 

[Enn49]

I'd forgotten that about you Enn. But you raised a bunch of Phiddipus didn't you? You never held one? Granted, they jump out of your hands almost always, but they drop a bungee line first. I've handled most species of wolf and jumper in my area, never got tagged. You should try it, I think it would help
Next thing you know, you'll have them living in your bedroom, free roaming, like I do I picked up a P audax in the ER and people were horrified. Then they all moved closer to look at the little beauty. (After playing yo yo with him til he stayed still, lol)

I've never held one intentionally. The Phiddipus did on occasion make it onto my hand but they were so tiny and as you say they drop that bungee line. I am happy to let a T walk on me if it chooses, I can cope with that, no flinching, in fact I picked my P. metallica up when her ExoTerra got smashed and she was in danger of being attacked by a cat. I am much better than I was and am less likely to kill a house spider but they can still make me jump. I blame my mother, 60+ years of her being terrified of spiders, it was bound to rub off on me .

 

[WolfSpider]

Great set of posts. Thanks Mass! Regarding cats and dogs: My cats like to watch me feed my Ts and perform enclosure maintenance. I let them. They seem to be as respectful of the Ts as I am. As far as I know, there has never been a cat fatality. There is even a colorful post of a cat vs OBT. (The cat won). Dogs however, are another story. I lock my dogs out of the portion of the house when I am performing husbandry. It is well known that Ts can kill dogs (especially in Australia—right @Dave Jay ??). Tom Moran has a vocal dog that he references on many of his videos. He, too, is careful to move the dogs outside before he does husbandry.

 

[Enn49]

Great set of posts. Thanks Mass! Regarding cats and dogs: My cats like to watch me feed my Ts and perform enclosure maintenance. I let them. They seem to be as respectful of the Ts as I am. As far as I know, there has never been a cat fatality. There is even a colorful post of a cat vs OBT. (The cat won). Dogs however, are another story. I lock my dogs out of the portion of the house when I am performing husbandry. It is well known that Ts can kill dogs (especially in Australia—right @Dave Jay ??). Tom Moran has a vocal dog that he references on many of his videos. He, too, is careful to move the dogs outside before he does husbandry.

I have 5 cats. The oldest girl couldn't care less about Ts, crickets or snakes but the others will fight over any dropped crickets so would probably do the same with a T so they get shut out of the room. When I do my nightly check on the Ts in the lower vivariums the youngest of the cats will sit and watch but I wouldn't risk opening any containers with her around. The dog just isn't bothered at all.

 

[MassExodus]

I've got three cats and three dogs. The cats are little murderers, they'd knock over every enclosure I have to get to the spiders. I don't even have to close the door though. My dogs don't allow them on their side of the house

 

[Enn49]

I've got three cats and three dogs. The cats are little murderers, they'd knock over every enclosure I have to get to the spiders. I don't even have to close the door though. My dogs don't allow them on their side of the house

My cats will curl up with the dog except one and she hates him and he's terrified of her.

 

[MassExodus]

My cats will curl up with the dog except one and she hates him and he's terrified of her.

Lmao

 

[Enn49]

Lmao

The biggest laugh is that he's a Doberman x Rotti, a big lad

 

[MassExodus]

The biggest laugh is that he's a Doberman x Rotti, a big lad

Holy crap that's hilarious. Honestly though I've met a lot of Rotties that were huge old tittybabies. Love the breed. Just like all bulldogs/protection /working dogs, it's all in how you raise them.

 

[Enn49]

Holy crap that's hilarious. Honestly though I've met a lot of Rotties that were huge old tittybabies. Love the breed. Just like all bulldogs/protection /working dogs, it's all in how you raise them.

The same with Dobermans. Ours was a rescue, he'd been badly treated. The guy who took him in did what he could with him but his wife was pregnant and couldn't cope with his boisterousness so we got him. He's a real softie but too lively even though he's nearly 7 now.

 

[MassExodus]

Yeah that's the Dobie in him, those pups have energy to spare..

 

[Mr. P]

We have six cats, a large rottweiler and three rats and they all play and snuggle together. My universe is so backwards you wouldn't believe it.

 

[Mr. P]

These two are BFFs. "Cats and dogs living together", what is this world coming to.